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Theism/atheism debates

Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby Mucha Man » 05 Mar 2016, 14:44

One of the many reasons not to believe we can be trained not to breathe for days, weeks, months, is that there are exceptionally motivated people who would jump on the chance to do this were it true. I've been researching freediving at the elite level for a few weeks and considering the techniques which allow people to dive to over 200m and hold one's breath for over 10 minutes come from yoga (and our own bizarre mammalian dive response) it is odd that divers would not be aware they were just scratching the surface.
“Everywhere else in the world is also really old” said Prof. Liu, a renowned historian at Beijing University. “We always learn that China has 5000 years of cultural heritage, and that therefore we are very special. It appears that other places also have some of this heritage stuff. And are also old. Like, really old.”

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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby Ermintrude » 05 Mar 2016, 15:56

Mucha Man wrote:One of the many reasons not to believe we can be trained not to breathe for days, weeks, months, is that there are exceptionally motivated people who would jump on the chance to do this were it true. I've been researching freediving at the elite level for a few weeks and considering the techniques which allow people to dive to over 200m and hold one's breath for over 10 minutes come from yoga (and our own bizarre mammalian dive response) it is odd that divers would not be aware they were just scratching the surface.


An actual application for for what seems like perhaps the world's most pointless activity. Finding food, escaping from housefires. Getting off on depriving your body of air, food, water, whatever just seems like the ultimate vanity of man's desire to control the physical world. Buddhism just seems like the application of dominion over oneself. Why? What's the point? Why are people psychologically drawn to it? I kind of understand the psychological hooks to Abrahamic religions, and even Hinduism seems to have its own internal logic. But Buddhism? Is it an attempt to come to terms with suffering through the four noble truths? Is that the point? The alleviation of pain? And is it my own psycho-social environment that makes that seem funny/childish?
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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby BrentGolf » 05 Mar 2016, 17:38

Ermintrude wrote:Buddhism just seems like the application of dominion over oneself. Why? What's the point? Why are people psychologically drawn to it? I kind of understand the psychological hooks to Abrahamic religions, and even Hinduism seems to have its own internal logic. But Buddhism? Is it an attempt to come to terms with suffering through the four noble truths? Is that the point? The alleviation of pain? And is it my own psycho-social environment that makes that seem funny/childish?


Oh no you didn't ! :no-no: You're going to get a right talkin' to by someone in this thread when he sees that. :popcorn:


One of the many reasons not to believe we can be trained not to breathe for days, weeks, months, is that there are exceptionally motivated people who would jump on the chance to do this were it true. I've been researching free diving at the elite level for a few weeks and considering the techniques which allow people to dive to over 200m and hold one's breath for over 10 minutes come from yoga (and our own bizarre mammalian dive response) it is odd that divers would not be aware they were just scratching the surface.



Triceratopses will probably say you have to be completely still for it to work for a year, but you're absolutely right. There would be so many practical applications if this were even remotely possible, even just a few minutes beyond where we are now. Are we really supposed to believe that Buddhism is immune to the power of Youtube? Nobody on earth ever thought to put up a video showing someone with these magical powers?

This is what really annoys me about people who believe in such things. We've heard it all. People that can levitate, read minds, actually bend spoons, become fire proof,etc... Not once ever was it captured on film in a scientific environment? :ponder:


Want to see what happens when someones beliefs in ancient mysticism come face to face with reality? Here's a Kung Fu master who can crush anybody without ever even touching them, just using the power of Chi. Watch how truly shocked he is that a regular dude can just punch him in the face. He actually believed this shit through and through.

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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby jimipresley » 05 Mar 2016, 17:56

BrentGolf wrote:


Love it. I wonder if he applied oil of bear tail to the wounds and had acupuncture for the pain. :bravo:
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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby Ermintrude » 05 Mar 2016, 19:01

BrentGolf wrote:
Ermintrude wrote:Buddhism just seems like the application of dominion over oneself. Why? What's the point? Why are people psychologically drawn to it? I kind of understand the psychological hooks to Abrahamic religions, and even Hinduism seems to have its own internal logic. But Buddhism? Is it an attempt to come to terms with suffering through the four noble truths? Is that the point? The alleviation of pain? And is it my own psycho-social environment that makes that seem funny/childish?


Oh no you didn't ! :no-no: You're going to get a right talkin' to by someone in this thread when he sees that. :popcorn:



:D

Without being too much of a dick, the proof is in the pudding. Places with a high concentration of Buddhists are depressing as fuck. I think it's the focus on minutiae that does it. Effect or cause? Or no connection?
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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby Mucha Man » 05 Mar 2016, 19:22

Bhutan is the happiest place on earth.
“Everywhere else in the world is also really old” said Prof. Liu, a renowned historian at Beijing University. “We always learn that China has 5000 years of cultural heritage, and that therefore we are very special. It appears that other places also have some of this heritage stuff. And are also old. Like, really old.”

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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby finley » 05 Mar 2016, 20:59

Mucha Man wrote:Bhutan is the happiest place on earth.

It's probably not the unhappiest. However, since most Bhutanese seem loath to discuss politics and the country has nothing that resembles an efficient economy, one suspects there's room for improvement.
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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby Mucha Man » 05 Mar 2016, 21:35

finley wrote:
Mucha Man wrote:Bhutan is the happiest place on earth.

It's probably not the unhappiest. However, since most Bhutanese seem loath to discuss politics and the country has nothing that resembles an efficient economy, one suspects there's room for improvement.



Self-reported studies never lie.
“Everywhere else in the world is also really old” said Prof. Liu, a renowned historian at Beijing University. “We always learn that China has 5000 years of cultural heritage, and that therefore we are very special. It appears that other places also have some of this heritage stuff. And are also old. Like, really old.”

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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby MikeN » 05 Mar 2016, 22:25

There's a Zen story about a wandering monk who comes to a river bank where an ascetic has been practising extremely austere and powerful disciplines for decades; he tells the pilgrim he now has the power to walk on water across the river.

The Zen monk replies "For a small copper coin you could have paid the ferryman to take you across twenty years ago."
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Re: Theism/atheism debates

Postby antarcticbeech » 05 Mar 2016, 22:43

I heard that cannabis grows so plentifully in Bhutan it's often used to feed pigs. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Bhutanese pigs are the happiest in the world. Perhaps infectiously so. The Buddha statues seem skinnier there but still appear way over 12%. :noway: But it's hard to be sure. The Lonely Planet guides never have this kind of information. :bluemad: Perhaps the only way I can find THE TRUTH in this world is to start travelling with a set of calipers.

I think more scientists should be open towards religious experience. Like every time I see Steven Hawking I think: That guy really needs to try meditation. He'd be such a natural - he's had that whole "not moving" thing nailed for the last few decades, without even trying! I reckon he'd be able to concentrate for at least 5 seconds.
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